Week 9: Patriots 27 Dolphins 17, Postgame/Late Games Thread
by JohnHannahRules on Nov 8, 2009 4:16 PM EST
91 comments
Big-time divisional tilt, and the Pats performed when they had to.
Miami rolled out a couple of wrinkles to the catPhish this week, and it had an effect. A second quarter, 5 play, 80 yard touchdown drive had New England running around like a bunch of peewees, and a Joey Haynos reception from Ronnie Brown after what had been a tough goalline stand landed another 7 in the 'Phins ledger.
Pat White momentarily confused the lads, lining up at QB but running the old option (and taking a shot or two for his trouble). New England was having enough trouble setting the edge that they ultimately moved Big Vince out over stud LT Jake Long. It worked, sort of, but it didn't help the pass-rush much.
Speaking of the pass rush, it was still anemic. We can't seem to get pressure unless we bring a big-blitz. Pat Chung had one sack and one sick hit that doubtless helped Henne forget a little more of his childhood.
The Patriots, for their part, unveiled a recommitted Laurence Maroney who ran with a will and a punishing style that we've been longing to see. The line was opening holes and LOMO was finding them. Twice in the fourth quarter we started inside our 15. On the first series, Maroney and BJGE hammered us out to the 48 before we lost momentum.
That brutalizing was the key to escaping the box on the second deep-startng drive, as the 1st play was a play-action pass to Randy Moss for 17 yards that moved him into 17th all-time in career receiving yards.
Speaking of Mr. Moss, he had a couple of beautiful plays today against surprisingly game rookie corners. One was a peach of a one-hander down near the goalline -- a 37 yard reception that had us seeing 2007. The second was a no-soup-for-you special on a crossing route where he stiff-armed the defender and ran away for a 71 yard score. That TD moved Moss into 6th all-time. So a good day for Randy.
Henne made a real game of it, as his receivers dropped two catchable balls on Miami's 2nd-to-last possession (stupid penalties reared their ugly head throughout -- a glaring jump on the o-line at the end ruined what should have been a satisfying clock-killer of a drive).
All in all, an uneven day from the boys in blue. Great to see us running hard (24 for 109). The run defense was adequate considering the foe, but the defensive backfield got fooled a few times. I'm guessing Joey Porter will be blaming the officials, but I don't think he had a single tackle on the day. What's wrong J-Peezy? Nothing to say?
Key Late Games: Nuthin', really, until Pittsburgh and Denver kick off tomorrow at 8:30 (MNF).
Here's a thread for communal jibber-jabber:
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+1 to Kyle Arrington
signed off the practice squad at the last moment, who cracked Ted Ginn Jr. something fierce on the last kick of the day to get his name on the stat sheet.
As Mr. Sloan always says, there is no "I" in team, but there is an "I" in pie. And there's an "I" in meat pie. Anagram of meat is team... I don't know what he's talking about. --Shaun of the Dead
by JohnHannahRules on Nov 8, 2009 4:24 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
As a Hofstra alum, it's awesome to hear about Arrington's day.
Beer is good! And stuff!
by R_Adragna on Nov 8, 2009 7:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I rather like that 4.5 yard rush average
considering the run game ought to improve later on when they get Morris and Taylor back.
Token southern hemisphere guy - 14,688km from Foxboro. That's 9128 miles, for you heathens.
by Comedic.Sans on Nov 8, 2009 4:28 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
And Tate out-returned Ginn?
Sweet.
Token southern hemisphere guy - 14,688km from Foxboro. That's 9128 miles, for you heathens.
by Comedic.Sans on Nov 8, 2009 4:29 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Tate looked pretty good.
You could see what made him so successful at that in college — he seemed to change his pace with every stride.
As Mr. Sloan always says, there is no "I" in team, but there is an "I" in pie. And there's an "I" in meat pie. Anagram of meat is team... I don't know what he's talking about. --Shaun of the Dead
by JohnHannahRules on Nov 8, 2009 4:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
As often as not
it’s the ability to slow down for a bit to let a block form up, and then turn on the jets at the right time – that’s vision and intelligence, not just pure pace. Good to see.
Token southern hemisphere guy - 14,688km from Foxboro. That's 9128 miles, for you heathens.
by Comedic.Sans on Nov 8, 2009 4:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Hated to see them have to resort to the blitz to pressure Henne
That won’t go as well against Mr. Manning next week.
My life has been a trivial pursuit. Trivia: where three roads meet.
The more you know, the more you know that you don't know.
by SlotMachinePlayer on Nov 8, 2009 4:30 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Couldn't agree more.
It’s been a problem all season and the main way we’ve missed Seymour.
As Mr. Sloan always says, there is no "I" in team, but there is an "I" in pie. And there's an "I" in meat pie. Anagram of meat is team... I don't know what he's talking about. --Shaun of the Dead
by JohnHannahRules on Nov 8, 2009 4:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Wouldn't have been a problem if the LBs hadn't strangely disappeared
Anyone miss Vrabel? Heh.
Token southern hemisphere guy - 14,688km from Foxboro. That's 9128 miles, for you heathens.
by Comedic.Sans on Nov 8, 2009 4:33 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah. I don't know what Banta-Cain has in him, but I'm guessing that we've seen what he's got.
Burgess has to be considered a bust and I’m ready to move Thomas into that column as well. Still a need — I wonder what Crable has in him, or McKenzie.
As Mr. Sloan always says, there is no "I" in team, but there is an "I" in pie. And there's an "I" in meat pie. Anagram of meat is team... I don't know what he's talking about. --Shaun of the Dead
by JohnHannahRules on Nov 8, 2009 4:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Crable's physical stuff from the combine was phenomenal
He’s enormous, strong, quick. If he was healthy and had any technique at all, he’d be a sack-monster – he’d be just plain difficult to stop.
Token southern hemisphere guy - 14,688km from Foxboro. That's 9128 miles, for you heathens.
by Comedic.Sans on Nov 8, 2009 4:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Unfortunately he has to stay healthy enough to play in the regular season, and maybe post-season
He’s fooled me twice so far. Third time’s a show me.
My life has been a trivial pursuit. Trivia: where three roads meet.
The more you know, the more you know that you don't know.
by SlotMachinePlayer on Nov 9, 2009 10:43 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Burgess was good...
…for a roughing the passer penalty
Keep the faith!
by Marima on Nov 8, 2009 4:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Hoodie might lose his love of veterans at this rate
Galloway, Springs, Burgess, Adalius Thomas, all getting usurped… might be a good year next year to be a UFA, a la Gary Guyton.
Token southern hemisphere guy - 14,688km from Foxboro. That's 9128 miles, for you heathens.
by Comedic.Sans on Nov 8, 2009 5:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Carolina 14, Saints 0 with 5:00 left in the 1st
As Mr. Sloan always says, there is no "I" in team, but there is an "I" in pie. And there's an "I" in meat pie. Anagram of meat is team... I don't know what he's talking about. --Shaun of the Dead
by JohnHannahRules on Nov 8, 2009 4:30 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Brees has tossed a pick, returned out to midfield.
I wonder how many 2nd half come-backs over their own mistakes the Saints have.
As Mr. Sloan always says, there is no "I" in team, but there is an "I" in pie. And there's an "I" in meat pie. Anagram of meat is team... I don't know what he's talking about. --Shaun of the Dead
by JohnHannahRules on Nov 8, 2009 4:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm confused...
is it impressive that they can come back from holes that they dig themselves, or is it a weakness that they get themselves into trouble in the first place?
Token southern hemisphere guy - 14,688km from Foxboro. That's 9128 miles, for you heathens.
by Comedic.Sans on Nov 8, 2009 4:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
then they could say that they beat themselves
Keep the faith!
by Marima on Nov 8, 2009 4:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
And the referees colluded!
Very Ray Lewis-like logic. I’ll throw flags into the stands, now.
Token southern hemisphere guy - 14,688km from Foxboro. That's 9128 miles, for you heathens.
by Comedic.Sans on Nov 8, 2009 5:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
well I'll be damned
Current Phinsider Feud Points: 23
Sparano: Joey Porter, What is best in life?
Porter: To crush The Jets, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of Mark Sanchez
by Patssuck456 on Nov 8, 2009 4:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
good game guys
If only we had a #1 WR.
We really missed Big ferg and Crowder, they should be back for the rematch.
Vontae is gonna be a stud, I expect him to catch many passes from Tom Brady in the future.
Current Phinsider Feud Points: 23
Sparano: Joey Porter, What is best in life?
Porter: To crush The Jets, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of Mark Sanchez
by Patssuck456 on Nov 8, 2009 4:45 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Vontae impressed. I think you guys are set at corner for a few years.
As Mr. Sloan always says, there is no "I" in team, but there is an "I" in pie. And there's an "I" in meat pie. Anagram of meat is team... I don't know what he's talking about. --Shaun of the Dead
by JohnHannahRules on Nov 8, 2009 4:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You could get back Chris Chambers, he's free now. Haha.
I remember hearing the Pats were looking pretty hard at Vontae Davis with their first round pick before the last draft, but chose to trade down and pick up extra second rounders. So it’s not surprising to see him play pretty well now – Hoodie has a fairly good record at scouting first-round guys.
Token southern hemisphere guy - 14,688km from Foxboro. That's 9128 miles, for you heathens.
by Comedic.Sans on Nov 8, 2009 4:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Chambers is with KC, plus they got him off waivers.
Current Phinsider Feud Points: 23
Sparano: Joey Porter, What is best in life?
Porter: To crush The Jets, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of Mark Sanchez
by Patssuck456 on Nov 8, 2009 4:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Ah, hadn't heard that
Can’t say I’m surprised, KC needs anything they can get.
Token southern hemisphere guy - 14,688km from Foxboro. That's 9128 miles, for you heathens.
by Comedic.Sans on Nov 8, 2009 4:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Starting with an OFFENSIVE LINE
Pick a position, ANY position, it would be an upgrade. Maybe they can draft around 1600 lbs of linemen next year.
My life has been a trivial pursuit. Trivia: where three roads meet.
The more you know, the more you know that you don't know.
by SlotMachinePlayer on Nov 9, 2009 10:46 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Nothing wrong with Vontae's confidence... that's a name we'll be hearing for a while
Good game, a physical fight to the finish just as I thought. I was hoping it would be a little more lopsided though, to save some of my fingernails for next week’s game against the Colts.
Keep the faith!
by Marima on Nov 8, 2009 4:59 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Can you hear the hype-machine cranking up?
As Mr. Sloan always says, there is no "I" in team, but there is an "I" in pie. And there's an "I" in meat pie. Anagram of meat is team... I don't know what he's talking about. --Shaun of the Dead
by JohnHannahRules on Nov 8, 2009 5:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Nah, the hype-machine is at Brett Favre's steakhouse
It sleeps in John Madden’s bus.
Token southern hemisphere guy - 14,688km from Foxboro. That's 9128 miles, for you heathens.
by Comedic.Sans on Nov 8, 2009 5:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If there is no Favre, there is no hype
by rroan28 on Nov 8, 2009 5:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Imagine there's no Favre, it's easy if you try....
My life has been a trivial pursuit. Trivia: where three roads meet.
The more you know, the more you know that you don't know.
by SlotMachinePlayer on Nov 9, 2009 10:46 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Both Smith and Davis will get better as the year goes on
They’ll be studs for years to come IMO, althoygh Smith needs to work on his tackling
Current Phinsider Feud Points: 23
Sparano: Joey Porter, What is best in life?
Porter: To crush The Jets, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of Mark Sanchez
by Patssuck456 on Nov 8, 2009 9:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Davis will be like Revis.
Smith will be solid. I don’t see him being as dominant, but I see him as better than good.
by The Hill on Nov 8, 2009 9:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Good game
This team looks scary good again.
I just want to say I hate Randy Moss…and I mean that in the best way possible. As in, I hate that he’s not playing for the Fins.
by rroan28 on Nov 8, 2009 5:17 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Al Davis fire-sale coming to a place near you, soon!
All assets must go
Token southern hemisphere guy - 14,688km from Foxboro. That's 9128 miles, for you heathens.
by Comedic.Sans on Nov 8, 2009 5:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Further thought
Brady REALLY needs to work on his accuracy this coming week. He’s getting better but he’s still not great at hitting a moving target. It’s really hurting his long ball.
by satsunada on Nov 8, 2009 6:07 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Brag when you can, I say
My prediction for this game was 28-13, Pats.
As Mr. Sloan always says, there is no "I" in team, but there is an "I" in pie. And there's an "I" in meat pie. Anagram of meat is team... I don't know what he's talking about. --Shaun of the Dead
by JohnHannahRules on Nov 8, 2009 6:28 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
27-17 is a lot closer to a coronary than 28-13. Haha
Still, the prediction of the Pats scoring was a nice trick – the last two games didn’t give a really good indication of where the Pats are.
Token southern hemisphere guy - 14,688km from Foxboro. That's 9128 miles, for you heathens.
by Comedic.Sans on Nov 8, 2009 6:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
My secret "success against crappy teams discounting method" is the reason.
And I’m not sharing it.
As Mr. Sloan always says, there is no "I" in team, but there is an "I" in pie. And there's an "I" in meat pie. Anagram of meat is team... I don't know what he's talking about. --Shaun of the Dead
by JohnHannahRules on Nov 8, 2009 8:07 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Just got back from the game...
Favorite moment:
In the last couple minutes, they showed Joey Porter’s picture with his game stats (0 tackles) for about 2-3 minutes and then they just showed him on the bench for another couple minutes, all on the big screen.
It was glorious.
Some notes:
If Pat White can throw, the PatCat will be DANGEROUS. It was unbelievable the space that package created. At LEAST 2-3 players covered Ricky and Ronnie EACH and Pat had another 2-3 on his tail. That means that there are another couple of players WIDE OPEN. It was scary to watch.
Brandon Tate is a stud. He is going to be AWESOME. His returns weren’t flashy, but he got the job done. He did a good job of turning the initial return coverage and getting into the second layer.
I’m not trusting Maroney yet. He had a great game, but that was mostly in part because of the secondary being souped up and the front line being weakened. He wasn’t running into much defense.
Vontae Davis is better than Sean Smith. Watching them in coverage, Vontae was NEVER a step behind his man. He was awesome. I’m kind of worried. Smith was good, and he’ll be solid, but he wasn’t amazing. He left a lot of space and let Brady challenge that. Davis left no space be challenged. That being said, I was in the damn bathroom when Moss got his 71 yard TD.
Henne faded quickly. He was sharp and has great accuracy, but his “amazing arm strength” never showed. When the Phins were playing from behind, I could sense that he was trying to will the Dolphins to victory, but his “will” only led to overthrows, underthrows and passes too hard for the receivers to catch. He needs to get a stud receiver and a security receiver in order to succeed as a QB.
Thomas has great knowledge, but he’s lost a step and he needs to step aside and teach the youngsters. He knows how to read a defense and he knows how to anticipate plays, but he’s unable to follow through and make them. The one play that sticks out of him knowing a play was his 11 yard sack on Chad Henne on the Wildcat formation. That was him sensing the play and making it. Most of the other time, he was always just a step behind.
The French Fries at Gillette are phenomenal. The Hot dogs are not.
Canadians love the Patriots. I was surrounded by Quebec-ians, and they didn’t even know each other. Seriously. I counted at LEAST 35 people from Canada. It was cool.
I saw a Phin fan in a white White jersey sitting next to another in an orange Brown jersey. It was soooo close to being perfect.
Brady’s still getting in sync. He tried early, on his pick, to get a big play early, but he just doesn’t have the touch yet. He got it early, but he needs to enter the game with that touch. It was an underthrown pass in double coverage. Not that smart.
Overall, it was a successful game. Beautiful day, beautiful game and I’m very happy.
by The Hill on Nov 8, 2009 7:28 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
Couple other things...
…Hanson’s numbers are low because he was punting usually beyond midfield, or around that point, but he was still leaving yards on the field. He needs to do better.
Rookie mistakes led to one drive where the Phins committed 2 pass interference penalties. They’ll learn, but Aiken did a GREAT drop of dropping back and drawing the interference
by The Hill on Nov 8, 2009 7:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Great day to watch a game
I’ll be at the Jets game in two weeks. No telling what the weather’ll be like then.
As Mr. Sloan always says, there is no "I" in team, but there is an "I" in pie. And there's an "I" in meat pie. Anagram of meat is team... I don't know what he's talking about. --Shaun of the Dead
by JohnHannahRules on Nov 8, 2009 8:06 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Way cool... thanks for sharing
Loved the story about Joey Porter… so did the rest of the crowd here. Awesome. Lucky you, what a terrific day to be at the game.
Keep the faith!
by Marima on Nov 8, 2009 8:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, Porter's doing his best Jet impression.
Trust me, I am not amused
by rroan28 on Nov 8, 2009 9:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
rec'd
you made several good points, I think we have plenty of security WRs for Henne, the thing is that we dont have that guy, but we will more than likely get him in the offseason, parcells cant be that dman stubbon when it comes to his philosophy, we need a true #1 WR. Golden Tate comes to mind
Also what I love about Vontae is how clutch he has been.
Current Phinsider Feud Points: 23
Sparano: Joey Porter, What is best in life?
Porter: To crush The Jets, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of Mark Sanchez
by Patssuck456 on Nov 8, 2009 9:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm sure most Phin Fans will agree...
…that a security WR is someone who will catch everything. Someone like Welker. Or Camarillo. Unfortunately, Camarillo, in my mind, is sent downfield too much because he has to, even though he’d be better off playing underneath like Welker. I agree with you getting Golden Tate. Maybe even Damian Williams in the first round.
I always thought Ginn was an Al Davis-esque pick by the Dolphins. The best players are the ones who excel at their position, not the ones who look good at the combine. Ginn was good at running the ball. Not being a receiver. I think you made a post with that point on the Phinsider, or someone else did, that you guys should use Ginn for handoffs, instead of as a receiver. I agree.
by The Hill on Nov 8, 2009 9:25 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Darren Sproules-like?
That could be interesting. Short passes even Ginn can catch and give him downfield blocking. It’d be a short-handoff/kick-return thing.
Token southern hemisphere guy - 14,688km from Foxboro. That's 9128 miles, for you heathens.
by Comedic.Sans on Nov 8, 2009 10:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Ginn is someone that does best when the ball is in his hands. Problem is, those hands are made of stone.
Last year he was really effective on reverses, I think Henning needs to use him more in that role again.
by rroan28 on Nov 8, 2009 10:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree on Camarillo
I love Greg Camarillo. He’s sure-handed, and he finds a way to get open. I point to the first Jets game where he had back-to-back clutch 3rd down grabs on the game winning drive.
If we can get someone that can be a serious downfield guy, that would allow Camarillo to play that underneath role, which would be beneficial on all sides.
by rroan28 on Nov 8, 2009 10:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Well i’m a Fins fan obvious enough if you cant tell)
Pats played well. Especially Moss, he was a beast
Maroney also did suprisingly well considering our Rush Defense should have contained him a lot better
And I will agree with everything negative you have to say about Porter! he hasn’t been doing shit besides running his mouth and occupying space.
he should do the smart thing, retire with Ray Lewis and let JT takes the WS and Wake take the SS and next meeting if that happens… Brady Sandwich anyone?
Another thing whats with the miss match of Davis and Moss? Did BB keep switching him so he wouldn’t be matched with the taller Smith?
Do our recievers exist? Ginn crawls out the hole, Bess is stumbling but hope is not lost.
Gibril i like you and imma let you finish the season but, Ed Reed is the best safety of all time, of all time!!
by dolfan0918 on Nov 8, 2009 8:38 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
P.S. kill the damn the Jets next time you play them
if we can’t win the division, there is stil lthe wild card and ill be damned if the Jets take that from us
Do our recievers exist? Ginn crawls out the hole, Bess is stumbling but hope is not lost.
Gibril i like you and imma let you finish the season but, Ed Reed is the best safety of all time, of all time!!
by dolfan0918 on Nov 8, 2009 8:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Trust me
We want that one even more than you do.
As Mr. Sloan always says, there is no "I" in team, but there is an "I" in pie. And there's an "I" in meat pie. Anagram of meat is team... I don't know what he's talking about. --Shaun of the Dead
by JohnHannahRules on Nov 8, 2009 8:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Pats will do their best to keep Rexy quiet
your Dolphins did their part already… twice.
Keep the faith!
by Marima on Nov 8, 2009 8:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'd like to hang a hundred on them.
Then listen to Rexy say, the better team lost.
My life has been a trivial pursuit. Trivia: where three roads meet.
The more you know, the more you know that you don't know.
by SlotMachinePlayer on Nov 9, 2009 10:56 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Judging by Porter's talents...
…he should go play for the Jets next.
by The Hill on Nov 8, 2009 8:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
he should either start producing or send him to the AFC West along with every other older and/or discarded Pats and Fins players
Your welcome KC and OAK (yes i also count Chambers)
Do our recievers exist? Ginn crawls out the hole, Bess is stumbling but hope is not lost.
Gibril i like you and imma let you finish the season but, Ed Reed is the best safety of all time, of all time!!
by dolfan0918 on Nov 8, 2009 8:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The West Coast Retirement Home for Old and Overpaid Players?
I’m pretty sure the Patriots have a controlling stake-holding in that, care of B. Belichick.
Token southern hemisphere guy - 14,688km from Foxboro. That's 9128 miles, for you heathens.
by Comedic.Sans on Nov 8, 2009 10:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
And if a player is too old for Belichick, that's saying something
Looking at the 93-year old Junior Seau
by rroan28 on Nov 8, 2009 10:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Junior Seau...
…has been playing football since before I was born. And probably just as long as some of his team mates have been alive (Pat Chung!)
by The Hill on Nov 8, 2009 11:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
but, in the right situations, he can still play
and he’s a great example to the younger guys. He’s made more solo tackles than all our newbies combined.
My life has been a trivial pursuit. Trivia: where three roads meet.
The more you know, the more you know that you don't know.
by SlotMachinePlayer on Nov 9, 2009 10:58 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Great game guys.
I found out at the last minute that CBS wasn’t showing the game here. Instead I had to watch the Colts/Texans (ugh). I did get to see the last minute though. It looked like a good game from what I could tell from the recap.
From what I heard you guys played very well and a tight game, aside from Brady’s interception. Congrats on the win and hopefully we’ll have just as good a game in a few weeks, with the Phins coming out on top of course. =P
On the other side, it sounded like Vontae Davis had a pretty good game, which give me hope for the future if its true what I heard that he was on Moss all day. I wouldn’t expect a rookie CB to shut down Moss, but from what I hear he did a fairly good job on him. And from what I can tell from my fantasy teams stats, Welker didn’t have as dominating of a day as he could have, which I am happy about (as a Phins fan) and sad about (as a fantasy team owner).
Regardless, great game guys, good luck the rest of the season and beat the goddamned Jets.
"Why don't you put that in a memo and entitle it 'Shit I Already Know'!" - Sarge from Red vs. Blue
I can't brain today, I have the dumb.
28 "Phinsider Feud" Points
by Chupathingy on Nov 8, 2009 9:04 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Sorry you didn't get to see the game.
Alot of good back and forth. I hope we don’t beat the Jets so much as bury them.
My life has been a trivial pursuit. Trivia: where three roads meet.
The more you know, the more you know that you don't know.
by SlotMachinePlayer on Nov 9, 2009 11:00 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Maroney ran TOUGH! I really enjoyed his rushing ability today.
even if miami didn’t have 2 of their starting LBs, The ends, OLBs, and the backup should’ve been enough when it comes to the #6 rushing defense in the league. Maroney ran with authority and grinded out extra yards. to me, he did not disappoint. I shall give him:
a B+.
by patriotguy on Nov 8, 2009 9:11 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Not a knock on the Dolphins...
…but most of the teams they’ve played (apart from the Jets and Bills) have been pass-first teams, which may lead to skewed run defense numbers.
by The Hill on Nov 8, 2009 9:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah that's true.
But he did run HARD! If he was the marone who danced on every run play(or 90% of them), then he would not be as successful as he was today. I give him plenty of kudos for his performance. i don’t think anyone expected him to run like he did.
by patriotguy on Nov 8, 2009 9:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Oh, absolutely.
He hit every run HARD. Immediately hard. Which leads me to think that if the Phins hadn’t been worrying about their rookies in the secondary and had normal defense in the box, Maroney would have run immediately in walls every time without letting the play develop.
by The Hill on Nov 8, 2009 9:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Didn't he always play like that?
I thought he was a “pound the gap” kinda guy as a Gopher too.
by rroan28 on Nov 8, 2009 9:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah
But he also was part of a tandem. That type of style doesn’t work in the NFL unless you have a Brandon Jacobs kind of frame. Maroney does not. He needs to mix his patience with his hard hitting of the hole. He’s patient waaaaay too much, when nothing developing and he actually needs to make his own plays. He also hits the hole when nothing’s there. He really takes advantage (the past three weeks/end of the ‘07 season) of when the defense is giving extra attention to the secondary. Which I guess is a good thing. He does his job and keeps the defense honest and doesn’t allow to them to fully focus on the pass attack. I guess we’re all just upset that he can’t do ANYTHING when the defense is designed to stop the run.
by The Hill on Nov 8, 2009 9:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
In re: when there's nothing
He does run a little “light.” I don’t know what his actual weight is, but it’s kind of like pitching. Some guys seem to have a heavier fastball. Some runners seem to be more solid. Something about the way they use their bodies, or perhaps their core strength. Marion Barber — Maroney’s Gopher teammate — runs heavy. Maroney doesn’t.
As Mr. Sloan always says, there is no "I" in team, but there is an "I" in pie. And there's an "I" in meat pie. Anagram of meat is team... I don't know what he's talking about. --Shaun of the Dead
by JohnHannahRules on Nov 8, 2009 9:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
For some reason 220lb comes to mind for Maroney
He’s fairly solid, but he’s not Brandon Jacobs. Barber runs lower to the ground, and when he lowers his shoulders he’s hitting defender’s waists, not their arms. Defenders have to either get lower than him, which puts them off balance, or they have to arm-tackle. So they’re susceptible to falling over or getting juked, or they’re likely to have tackles broken because they don’t/can’t wrap up.
Token southern hemisphere guy - 14,688km from Foxboro. That's 9128 miles, for you heathens.
by Comedic.Sans on Nov 8, 2009 10:02 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He runs too upright most of the time. Trying to juke people.
The ’backers who are not fooled can drop their pads lower and stop him. He had 1 nice hit on an end around where he dropped his pads low before contact and got two more yards. That was sweet.
He’d be better dropping the pads through the hole (ala Sammy Morris) and then look for some daylight to stretch it out. He’s no Tomlinson. Although, Tomlinson is no Tomlinson anymore either.
My life has been a trivial pursuit. Trivia: where three roads meet.
The more you know, the more you know that you don't know.
by SlotMachinePlayer on Nov 9, 2009 11:06 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
So..
Would you say that a focal point for the Pats next year would be a running back? Or is the defense of a higher priority?
by rroan28 on Nov 8, 2009 10:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Hoodie says he takes the best player available, irrespective of position,
so it’s always hard to make predictions about what he’ll draft. Prior to this draft everyone was expecting an OLB to enter the ranks, but that never eventuated. It probably depends on what HBs are in the draft and where they’re likely to be picked, versus what HBs are likely to enter free agency. If he can get a stud rookie running back at good value, he probably wouldn’t turn it down, though.
Otherwise, a good pass-rushing OLB or DE is a distinct possibility, and Belichick has always liked drafting linesmen on both sides of the ball.
Token southern hemisphere guy - 14,688km from Foxboro. That's 9128 miles, for you heathens.
by Comedic.Sans on Nov 8, 2009 10:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i thought he was going to pick donald brown or mauluga.
brown seemed so like a patriot in so many ways.
by patriotguy on Nov 8, 2009 10:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Given the way he's been playing, Mauluga looked viable
Although I suppose his non-selection is a vote of confidence in Guyton and Mayo (well rewarded, too), and the necessary future depth is added in the injured rookie McKenzie, albeit not this season.
Token southern hemisphere guy - 14,688km from Foxboro. That's 9128 miles, for you heathens.
by Comedic.Sans on Nov 9, 2009 1:10 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Historically,
Running back is a bad bet to spend high draft picks on. Not that you can’t get a great back in the early rounds — you can. But the useful life of a running back in the NFL (not to be crass) is less than the cost of a high-pick back can justify. At least that seems to be the case in the moneyball-esque draft philosophy that the Pats appear to employ. Generally speaking, there are more serviceable runningbacks on the market at any given time than there are teams — there’s really no excuse for not having a decent backfield. I know Maroney isn’t a superstar, but with our stable (when healthy) I think the Pats have all kinds of variety and talent that works for what they do. Teams like the Seahawks, who can’t seem to find even one, have no one to blame but themselves.
As Mr. Sloan always says, there is no "I" in team, but there is an "I" in pie. And there's an "I" in meat pie. Anagram of meat is team... I don't know what he's talking about. --Shaun of the Dead
by JohnHannahRules on Nov 8, 2009 10:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Well, it's how the Pats draft...
…we drafted Maroney when we were looking for a stud back. However, we’ve gradually become a stable of backs so a premier RB isn’t really on our wish list. We just want 2-3 RBs who can produce when called upon. I wouldn’t say no to using one of our 2nd rounders on a RB, but I wouldn’t be surprised if we didn’t.
I would say that next draft we’ll focus on D-Line and OLB. Have to remember that we still have Crable and McKenzie who are on IR who haven’t seen a snap, so they’ll basically be rookies as well, but with an idea of the system. We’ll definitely pick a youngster to replace Seymour’s spot and I think our lack of a pass rush has been a big of enough focus that BB will HAVE to get a stud pass rusher.
by The Hill on Nov 8, 2009 11:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
not to sure about that.
he may have done it plenty of times before, but i didn’t see him do it too much this season, and before he made breakout games in 07. just because they were worrying about their secondary, doesn’t mean they won’t focus on their strength just as much. He’s making a lot more better reads this season, and looks, for now, like he can be counted on for a 4+ yard run. We all know it takes more than just the RB to make a successful running play(i’m sick of hearing people calling him a bust).
I think he will only get better, and will eventually be a factor in this offense(although he basically already is).
by patriotguy on Nov 9, 2009 10:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
When he hasn't been injured, he's been running around 4.3 yards per carry
which is hard to call a bust, especially when Brady’s been lighting it up in the meantime. Especially when nobody else has been doing any better within the same offence while on the ground.
Token southern hemisphere guy - 14,688km from Foxboro. That's 9128 miles, for you heathens.
by Comedic.Sans on Nov 9, 2009 11:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
we obviously missed Ferguson and Crowder badly today
Current Phinsider Feud Points: 23
Sparano: Joey Porter, What is best in life?
Porter: To crush The Jets, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of Mark Sanchez
by Patssuck456 on Nov 8, 2009 11:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Great game
Maroney ain’t the answer, I just hope you don’t find it soon. :)
Staring down Mark Sanchez. Just look into the those brown beauties.
by DolfinPhan on Nov 8, 2009 11:24 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Hoodie doesn't seem to like having one feature back
and the production overall of any Pats running back unit seems to justify his approach – the Pats were one fo the top rushing attacks last year, despite not even having a 1000 yard rusher in the roster. Three or four guys getting 4.5 yards per attempt each, over the length of a full season, seems to suit Hoodie more than having one guy put up 1400 yards and getting paid through the nose to do it. Especially if he can do it with second-hand free agent ex-‘Phin fullbacks playing pretty well at HB (especially when they’re so cheap!).
Token southern hemisphere guy - 14,688km from Foxboro. That's 9128 miles, for you heathens.
by Comedic.Sans on Nov 9, 2009 1:15 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
yes
unless another Corey Dillon comes along, discarded by another team and wearing a HUGE chip on his shoulder.
Keep the faith!
by Marima on Nov 9, 2009 7:36 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Like Cedric Benson?
My life has been a trivial pursuit. Trivia: where three roads meet.
The more you know, the more you know that you don't know.
by SlotMachinePlayer on Nov 9, 2009 11:10 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
maroney ran hard today
Props to him. I don’t think the hoodie necessarily likes or prefers a bevy of backs. i really think he would love a solid, durable back, ala Dillon or even Antowain Smith, problem is, noone has stayed healthy. So, a great job of the hoodie having excellent depth a the position. Actually nice to not have to pound Faulk and be able to use him where he is best suited.
Oh, you missed ferguson and crwoder? We missed Light, Green, Taylor, Morris, and Edelman, oh and maybe Koppen during the game.
Sarcasm aside, the Phins are tough. I think they are the best 3-5 team I’ve seen in awhile, and actually wonder if the wildcat doesn’t throw off the rhythm of the Henne led offense at times.
Best Brady has looked, and in his own words there is still room for improvement.
by furiousd on Nov 9, 2009 2:56 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Why I'm convinced Hoodie prefers running-back-by-committee
and that usually means a bevvy of so-so guys instead of a Ladanian Tomlinson or a Adrian Peterson. There are several reasons I can see for this:
1 – Durability. In a RBBC system, three or four guys can and do put out the same production as one guy (say, Peterson). While that means none of the individuals will be Pro Bowlers, what it does mean is that you’d need three or four broken legs to derail the run game completely. When you’ve got a genuine feature back of the Peterson-type, one broken leg ruins your season. Hoodie is all about a year-after-year dynasty of playoff appearances, and banking on one guy surviving each and every full season is anathema to the dynasty – it’s just too easy for a guy to get hurt. Feature-back driven teams are hit-and-miss – consider the Chargers of late; two playoff seasons versus two seasons ruined when LT picked up injuries.
2 – Cost. Hoodie’s picked up bit-part RBs from free agency and made them put out very good performances. Who has Maroney run alongside? Free agent castoffs – Sammy Morris, LaMont Jordan; older backs in search of Rings – Corey Dillon, Fred Taylor; undrafted free agents – BenJarvis Green-Ellis. All these guys, for their own reasons – lack of production elsewhere, the Superbowl-seeking discount, and the like – were fairly economical to what teams need to pay genuine feature backs.
3- Value. Hoodie loves trading around for players, draft picks, and the like. As Belichick said the other day, pretty much anyone bar Tom Brady is expendable – give him the right price, and for the sake of the franchise in both the present and future, he’ll trade away guys with little sentimentality. It’s might seem cold-blooded, but it’s the necessity of trying to build and maintain a dynasty in the salary-cap era.
Why is this a consideration? Running backs are the guys who have the least long-term trade value – their careers are shorter and they traditionally break down around age 30, their productive years are seen around the league as being numbered, and once they hit the wall they almost never recover. They also get hit 300 times a year, so injuries are common and often career-damaging or -ending. They’re basically the most risky investment you can get – you almost never get good value when you trade away a feature back. Consider this – who would trade a first round pick for 30 year old Ladanian Tomlinson right now? Nobody. Now, who would trade a first round pick for 30 year old Tom Brady? Pretty much anyone.
Hoodie likes getting his investment back – he got many productive years out of 29 year old first-round pick Richard Seymour, and gets a first-round pick returned to him in 2011 for the player in a trade with the Raiders. You don’t get that for 30 year old HBs. Drafting linesmen means both value now and at the end of their contracts; that’s nowhere near so likely with HBs.
Token southern hemisphere guy - 14,688km from Foxboro. That's 9128 miles, for you heathens.
by Comedic.Sans on Nov 9, 2009 4:21 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The ones who know me
know that I hardly ever compliment the other team the Pats play, but watching the game today, Miami has a very bright future ahead. The drive after half that ended in the TD used up over 10 mins of the clock. Very impressive drive. The Phin DB aren’t shy either. They played what I felt was a very good game against one of the top five pass offenses. Dolphin fans are on the precipice of something good if they keep tweeking the wildcat O. There are so many more variations with Pat White in the game that it could actually turn into a more overwhelming set than it is now.
As far as the Pats go, they did what they needed to do in beating a very good Miami team. Brady looks better, and the offense as a whole looks to be getting ready for the push for the postseason.
"Pain heals. Chicks dig scars. Glory...lasts forever."-Shane Falco, "The Replacements"
by Ironman63 on Nov 9, 2009 3:01 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
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