Is Vince Wilfork being treated fairly by the New England Patriots?
by MaPatsFan on Aug 24, 2009 11:48 PM EDT
in New England Patriots News
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PrintNormally, I am in lock step with Robert Kraft and the New England Patriots organization. One of the best owners in football, he hired THE best head coach of the past ten years and managed to turn this franchise around. Sure, many old timers can claim there's a lot of fair weather fans out there, but so what? Fans are good for a team no matter what the reason. As an old timer, take pride in your stick toitiveness (is that a word?) and, as a new timer, stay with us for better or for worse.
Yes, normally I like what Kraft does and think he's a heck of a lot smarter than I am. However, maybe not this time around. Vince Wilfork has a right to be livid. He has a right to be PO'd beyond belief. But that's not the type of player this team attracts. If you're a whinebag, you'll be shown the door in three seconds flat. Don't let your jerseys hit you on the way out. But Vince has been nothing but calm, cool, and collected:
"I see both sides. I can truly sit here and say, ‘I see where the organization is coming from,’ but at the same time, they see what I’m seeing: Other teams are getting deals done, also. But they might not have situations like we have, where we have a bunch of top-notch players that’s up. So, for that reason . . . they’re probably in a little awkward situation. But at the same time, the whole NFL is."
Say what you want about Vince Wilfork. Bring up his fines, his finger poking, bring it all up. The fact remains, he's one classy dude. Aside from being a standup guy, he's one of the best defensive tackles in the business and probably THE best 3-4 nose tackle. So why doesn't Kraft want to make him happy?
Wilfork's comments seem to confirm earlier sentiments from Patriots owner Robert Kraft, who said that the rules of the game had changed and the Patriots did not want to be at a competitive disadvantage in the future. He also warned that teams needed to be careful about additional expenditures because no one knows how things might turn out in the future. These comments were in response to questions about how the labor uncertainty affected long-term contracts.
Kraft is referring to the end of the current collective bargaining agreement which could cause a 2010 season without a salary cap and a possible 2011 lockout. Ironically it was the owners themselves who terminated the CBA early and now Kraft is trying to use it as leverage in the Wilfork negotiations.
Like I said, normally I love the guy and think he's done right by us fans. But, in this case, don't you think he may have cut off his nose to spite his face? Is Kraft talking out of both sides of his mouth?
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as a colts fan
im on the outside looking in here. the pats say they dont want/cant do a contract extension due to the labor agreement correct? But didn’t nick kaczur just receive an extension? Now I dont know if there are special circumstances or whatever but if i were Wilfork i would be pissed. Also, Kraft is crazy to piss off someone as big as Wilfork and he would be crazy not to give him an extension. I don’t know your cap situation but i’m guessing Wilfork wants Haynesworth money. Maybe thats why a deal hasn’t been done yet. Who knows with the pats. So damn secretive.
Please, please draft a big Defensive Tackle. Please?
Enter Fili Moala. Thank you Polian
wilfork doenst want Hanesworth money no one should get that kind of money
he probably wants to retire as a pats making 60 million for 8 years or somthing with like 20 mil for sure
hes only making like 2.2 this season as the BEST NT in football so its fair to get that big raise and pay him for what he did
by Patsfan4life on Aug 25, 2009 12:49 AM EDT up reply actions
Kaczur
I would guess the Kaczur and Wilfork situations are different in magnitude. As Pastfan4life mentions, Vince has said he doesn’t want Haynesworth money, but he DOES want a “comfortable” contract. It’s anyone’s guess what that means, but I’m thinking, with incentives, close to yearly double digits for the next four to six years. Kaczur’s contract moves from $2 million to $4.1 million over the course of four years.
Blogger at SBNation's Patriots blog, Pats Pulpit
I don't buy Kraft's argument
about labour negotiations. It is much more important, that the Pats have a number of key players whose contracts are running out, so they will ultimately have to choose.
Personally I think they want to check out Brace this year. If he is good enough, Wilfork will be allowed to leave. As good as he is, Seymour probably represents a more unique skill set, so it is probably more important to keep him.
I disagree
I think a 3-4 NT is more difficult to find than a DE. There’s a lot more to it than merely being big. He not only has to take up multiple blockers, but he must create a pass rush at the same time. He is the centerpiece of the entire defense and if that position downgrades, then the entire front 7 becomes less effective.
No matter what they say about labor agreements, they still have to field a team. And they have a chance to have the number one players at their positions as the centerpiece to both their offense and defense. Those opportunities don’t come up often.
Wilfork will make money
If he plays hard, either with us or without us. Maybe Kraft is hoping he can find someone almost as good for cheaper so he can spend more money elsewhere on the team.
"These players, a lot of other people didn't believe in them, but they believe in themselves. And that is all that matters."- Bill Belichick
I think Marima is right - that it is about the LENGTH of the contract
The three contracts quoted: Eli Manning, Matt Cassel (SIX years), Albert Hayneworth (SEVEN years).
It seems like they could do a front loaded contract for a longer period of time, but maybe that’s what Vince is pushing against. He wants guaranteed money through the WHOLE contract.
Vince, get a second opinion to see if your agent is doing the right thing by you. If he is, stick to your guns, you’re worth it.
The more you know, the more you know that you don't know.
by SlotMachinePlayer on Aug 25, 2009 11:22 AM EDT reply actions
It's simple.
They drafted Brace in the 2nd round to replace Wilfork. They also can franchise him next year for $6 mil (or so I read). Why sign him long term for more than that considering these circumstances?
All efforts must be made to put a team on the field that can win. That’s the object of the whole endeavor. The realities of doing that are what they are. Unfortunately, some players you would like to keep overprice themselves when they finish their rookie contract.
Warm up the Duck Boats!!!
Brace
I’m not necessarily convinced Brace is there as an outright replacement for Wilfork. Lest we forget, he’s lining up at DE too – covering Seymour? I haven’t seen which side Brace is lining up on when he’s a DE. Seymour is older and easier to replace – Jarvis Green is a backup 3-4 DE who has had plenty of production. Can’t really say the same for anyone who backs up a premium 3-4 nose tackle. Who’s the second NT on the depth chart of Pittsburgh, the Jets or the ‘Phins? That’s what I thought.
by Comedic.Sans on Aug 25, 2009 11:38 PM EDT up reply actions
He's livid?
I’ve seen no evidence of that. We know nothing about what’s on or off the table. We’re guessing based on the guesses of the media — famously accurate though the Boston media might be (that was a joke). Kraft’s arguments are thin, but they’re what you’d expect during any negotiation: whatever perceived justification for offering less than the player is asking is fine. It doesn’t have to be a good reason, it just has to be a reason.
Either a deal will get struck or it won’t. Vince is negotiating hard, as he should. The Krafts are negotiating hard, as they should. Both the Pats and Wilfork are now engaged in a game of chicken, with the end of his contract the train on the tracks. We have no idea — because we have no information — whether VW is over-pricing himself, over-estimating the length of his usefulness, or if the Patriots are following their Branch and Samuel model to the hilt.
Like everyone else, we’ll just have to wait. Unlike most contract situations, it looks like VW is going to play his ass off while whatever happens in the boardroom plays itself out. That’s the most any fan can ask for.
As Mr. Sloan always says, there is no "I" in team, but there is an "I" in pie. And there's an "I" in meat pie. Anagram of meat is team... I don't know what he's talking about. --Shaun of the Dead
by JohnHannahRules on Aug 25, 2009 12:26 PM EDT reply actions
Not IS livid
Has a RIGHT to be livid. I probably could’ve expressed that better.
Blogger at SBNation's Patriots blog, Pats Pulpit
There needs to be an "I don't know" choice in the poll
Not to be a waffler, but in this case we really don’t know what each side is looking for. And I say that with my love for Big Vince well documented on this site. How could we possibly know if Kraft is talking out of both sides of his mouth? How do we know what Wilfork’s side is asking for? I just want him signed.
For those of you who’ve read Michael Holley‘s book, Patriot Reign, pick it up again (I just did.) The sections on how BB (and crew) made the tough decisions on cutting particular players – and the behind the scenes look at both sides (with the media/fan perceptions and emotional connections thrown in on top of everything – is especially interesting. All I know for sure is that there’s a lot more here than we know now.
Keep the faith!
Brace again
I just thought – if it indeed turns on whether Brace is good/where Brace is good (NT, DE or both), the Pats management can play Seymour off against Vince. Who’ll take a pay cut to accomodate who? If Brace can happily cover both positions, it may well be a bidding war between Seymour and Wilfork to take a cut to stay in NE and keep their legacy in the uniform.
by Comedic.Sans on Aug 25, 2009 11:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Interesting point
And you are right: What is lost in the discussion is, that Seymour’s contract is also running out. It just doesn’t get the same press because he is already paid handsomely.
However, it can probably be safely said, that the Patriots are waiting to see some game action this year before they commit themselves.
In that case...
can someone watch out for where Brace is lining up, how often, and how well, and report back? I’m unable to see any of the Pats preseason games where I am, so it does intrigue me to see who he’s actually being groomed as a replacement for. This may be why Pryor’s lining up in DT as a erstwhile starter in the 4-3…
by Comedic.Sans on Aug 27, 2009 2:23 AM EDT up reply actions
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