Why is Tom Brady so easily dismissed from MVP conversations?
by MaPatsFan on Jan 5, 2010 8:18 PM EST
in Opinion/Analysis
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PrintAs the regular season closes, talk of the NFL's MVP naturally begins to surface. Every prognosticator on the planet adds their 2 cents and I am no exception. Yes, I'm very biased but why not? I write for a Patriots blog; my adoring fans expect me to be a homer every once in a while. ;-) Except this time, I don't think I'm being a homer.
For most of the year, I/we have complained that Tom Brady has struggled to find a rhythm with his receivers, that the rust clearly hadn't worn off. Wonderboy was simply not himself. After a 20-21 loss to Miami on December 6th, the team went through some tough moments. Sending players home, the "distraction" of a new son for Brady, the team rallied and won the remaining 3 December games which ultimately sealed a playoff berth.
Despite all the adversity Brady has had to contend with, rehabbing his knee being one of those "small" adversities, he is barely, if at all, mentioned as a 2009 MVP candidate. Look, I understand guys like Peyton Panning, Philip Rivers, and Drew Brees are having phenomenal years. If any of them wins the MVP, I will have no issues. However, Brady not even having a seat at the table is frustrating to me.
Going by NFL stats, he's in the top five for every category that matters. Oh, did I mention he's done a lot of this with cracked/broken/fractured ribs AND a broken throwing hand ring finger? Yeah, small detail. I work in an office at a computer and if I had 3 cracked/broken/fractured ribs and a broken finger, I'd be huddled over my keyboard in pain. Tom Brady PLAYS FOOTBALL!!! The fact that he's accomplished what he has with those injuries blows my mind.
Oh, and you may counter he's not at the top of the list in any of the stats linked above and you would be right. He's not. However, if you believe in Football Outsiders, you will notice that Wonderboy is ranked 1st using DYAR and 2nd for DVOA. No seat at the table. Yeah great.
Considering what he's overcome, and done it with one of the tougher schedules in the NFL, it's odd indeed that he's not being mentioned in any MVP conversations. Again, I'm ok with a guy like Manning getting the award; he's had a hell of a season. However, he hasn't had to overcome nearly the adversity Brady has. Shouldn't he at least get a nod?
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why?
6 losses would be why.
MVP doesn’t take injuries (past & present) into consideration. It looks at the most dominant players on the most dominant teams. The Patriots are not a dominant team right now. Sadly.
"simul justus et peccator"
He's not discussed...
…because no one should be discussed besides Chris Johnson. I don’t care that the Titans didn’t make the playoffs…they would have been 0-16 without Johnson. I’d say that makes him pretty damn valuable. He had a historic season that fans are lucky to have witnessed, and this should be a landslide MVP race.
Johnson would get my vote
But I doubt he finishes in the top five because his team didn’t even have a winning record, let alone get to the playoffs. The voters who decide on NFL awards are even more myopic than the voters for baseball’s Hall of Fame.
CJ is insane.
As Mr. Sloan always says, there is no "I" in team, but there is an "I" in pie. And there's an "I" in meat pie. Anagram of meat is team... I don't know what he's talking about. --Shaun of the Dead
by JohnHannahRules on Jan 6, 2010 10:40 AM EST up reply actions
uuuhhhhhhhhh......
because he’s not even the mvp of his own team according to the boston media cough ron borges cough
Ron Borges isn't the "boston media"
he’s an expert on sarcasm who writes an occasional thoughtful column when he can forget his hatred of Belichick and the Pats for a minute.
Keep the faith!
He's also a hack plagiarist who was fired when caught red handed.
I am totally disgusted that this guy still is given a voice in the media.
Just Google ‘plagiarism’ and ‘borges’.
The internet has killed much of journalism.
There was a time when a journalist would attempt to research his subject and write an informed article. Now you can just google and find out what everyone else thinks and add your voice to the throng.
My life has been a trivial pursuit. Trivia: where three roads meet.
The more you know, the more you know that you don't know.
by SlotMachinePlayer on Jan 6, 2010 9:59 AM EST up reply actions
the really sad thing
is that the internet and google have the capacity to improve journalism, because they make it so much easier to fact-check.
As Mr. Sloan always says, there is no "I" in team, but there is an "I" in pie. And there's an "I" in meat pie. Anagram of meat is team... I don't know what he's talking about. --Shaun of the Dead
by JohnHannahRules on Jan 6, 2010 10:38 AM EST up reply actions
No answer to why not MVP
but he is the most deserving of Comeback POY, that’s for sure
How can you not love a team that does this?
That's my thought as well.
Could have been a career ending injury, yet came back solidly. I would argue that Welker was the Pats MVP this year and if Brady isn’t MVP of his team, how could he be MVP of the league?
My life has been a trivial pursuit. Trivia: where three roads meet.
The more you know, the more you know that you don't know.
by SlotMachinePlayer on Jan 6, 2010 9:32 AM EST up reply actions
We just can't forget...
… that Brady was throwing (so far) to two excellent wide receivers – both among top5 DYAR (Welker, 3rd, and Moss, 5th). TWO TOP5 WIDE RECEIVERS.
Add our TE Watson, 1st DVOA and 10th DYAR, in this list, and we have a GREAT receiver team, wich make the work a little less tough to Wonderboy.
bit of a chicken and egg question, though, isn't it?
As Mr. Sloan always says, there is no "I" in team, but there is an "I" in pie. And there's an "I" in meat pie. Anagram of meat is team... I don't know what he's talking about. --Shaun of the Dead
by JohnHannahRules on Jan 6, 2010 10:39 AM EST up reply actions
Brady is damned either way
Back when Brady didn’t have great receivers and was still leading this team to Super Bowl victories, he was left out of the conversation because he wasn’t putting up MVP numbers. Now that he puts up MVP numbers, he’s discounted because of having great receivers.
On FO, some posters thought Welker didn't deserve the Pro Bowl
…over V-Jax, and part of the rationale was that Brady was throwing to him and Moss was stretching the field. (Even though Marshall was a more obvious guy to exclude.)
So Welker’d be nothing without Brady and Moss, Brady’d be nothing without Welker and Moss, and Moss is a malingerer. It’s like a Mobius Strip of crap, and it’s amazing that they get anything done.
by Female Patriots Enthusiast on Jan 6, 2010 10:03 PM EST up reply actions
and hi, by the way!
I realized that my post above sounded snarky. I didn’t mean to snark at you, but at the whole “Welker is overrated” conversation; sorry if I came off as cranky on my first post ever!
Oddly enough, I discovered this place through a Colts blog. (Most of my friends are Colts fans, and few are Pats fans, it’s like I’m surrounded.)
by Female Patriots Enthusiast on Jan 6, 2010 10:27 PM EST up reply actions
fo?
Non Sibi Sed Patriae.
Igitur qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum!
I bleed Scarlet and Grey...A Buckeye for Life
Wow, I'm really impressed with those numbers..
..and you make a very valid point. His name is definately missing from the discussion. However, when I think back upon the season, Brady just doesn’t strike me as someone who has routinely come up big. His throws doesn’t seem to be as accurate as you would expect from a MVP, and I would imagine that the game against the Titans also padded his stats just a bit.
Brady has flown under the radar and had a very good year, but the people being mentioned as MVP Candidates have all pretty much had career years. In conclusion: Should Brady have had some more recognition for the wonderful job he has done this year? Yeah, absolutely. Should he garner serious MVP consideration? Nope, not this year. :)
Yeah, I think that's it
He’s putting up the numbers where once, he didn’t. And when people expected Brady to be clutch – crucial game-winning drives, third-down conversions, etc – this year he seems to have struggled, especially in the televised games or against key opponents. That could be what is counting against him, his seeming lack of… Brady-ness. Even if he’s having a spectacular year statistically, he just doesn’t look like Wonderboy.
Token southern hemisphere guy - 14,688km from Foxboro. That's 9128 miles, for you heathens.
Expectations...
Brady’s performance in 2007 set the bar very high in terms of what is expected of him to have a “good” year. Many people, rightly or wrongly, also expected the Pats to again be a dominant team with Brady back this year, but we finished with 6 losses, one more than the Cassel led Pats of last year. Given the kind of year other quarterbacks in the league have had (Brees, Rivers, Manning, Farve) it’s hard to make a case for Brady this year.
Also, I don’t think it’s fair to say Brady is in the top five in “every category that matters:”
Quaterback rating: #11
Pct: #7
Avg Yards: #11
TDs: #6
Brady has performed like a top tier NFL quarterback, but not like an MVP quarterback.
Beyond statistics and wins and losses, there has been something missing from Brady’s performance this year. Many times in past years, Brady could have a pretty average game, but with two minutes left and the Pats down by 6, with the ball in Brady’s hand you knew the game was practically in the bag for the Pats. But those signature Brady come-from-behind drives have all come from opposing quarterbacks this year (Manning, Henne, Schaub). The only real signature comeback win we got this year was the opener in Buffalo…and that was against Buffalo, a team we always beat.
Of course that could all change in the playoffs (here’s hoping it does). But does anyone here truly, really feel that same sense of invincibility and inevitability in the last two minutes with the ball in Brady’s hands this year? Honestly, I don’t.
This is not all Brady’s fault (it may not be his fault at all): the team as a whole has had a tendency to collapse in the 4th quarter. But a big part of our defensive troubles in the 4th have come down to our inability to get key first downs that would put the game away. Again, I think it would be wrong to hang all the blame for this on Brady—I do not like our 4th quarter offensive play calling at all, it’s been too one-dimensional and conservative.
There have been flashes of Brady as an MVP caliber quarterback this season, just as there have been flashes of the Pats as a true championship caliber team, but they have been sporadic, or in several cases only lasted the first three quarters of football.
Anyway, that’s my honest assessment from where we sit at this point in the season. Here’s hoping we can finally bring it all together in the playoffs.
"If you know how to cheat, start now." - Earl Weaver
"…and that was against Buffalo, a team we always beat."
That was my concern when it looked like they were going to get Shanahan (a coach that usually beats us). Now that Washington has wrapped up Shanny, who will the Bills pick up?
My life has been a trivial pursuit. Trivia: where three roads meet.
The more you know, the more you know that you don't know.
by SlotMachinePlayer on Jan 6, 2010 11:05 AM EST up reply actions
Dunno...
But, IMO, the Bills need more than a good coach to be competitive next year.
"If you know how to cheat, start now." - Earl Weaver
You've got to start somewhere. HC and front office are the first candidates.
Without that, all the talent in the world doesn’t matter. See Raiders and Redskins.
My life has been a trivial pursuit. Trivia: where three roads meet.
The more you know, the more you know that you don't know.
by SlotMachinePlayer on Jan 6, 2010 11:11 AM EST up reply actions
Breaking news...Brady wins comeback player of the year!
A richly deserved honor given what he has had to overcome. Congrats to Tom.
"If you know how to cheat, start now." - Earl Weaver
That is the award I thought he deserved all along.
I hope Wes gets it next year.
My life has been a trivial pursuit. Trivia: where three roads meet.
The more you know, the more you know that you don't know.
by SlotMachinePlayer on Jan 6, 2010 11:17 AM EST up reply actions
Its not an award I really want my team's players winning.
It means they were injured and had to come back.
How do you give a guy the MVP award when the team he plays for had a better record the previous season without him?
"Yea, verily, we shall overcome thy pathetic attempts at defense, thou jelly-livered knave! Talk not of thy smack to me, for I shall wedge mine booted foot nine furlongs up thy ass, bitch! Canst thou dig it??"
Mass exodus on D?
Same jerseys, different players wearing them.
If we tried this “Re-building” thing last year, I think we might have seen a 5-11 season.
The "D" was not the problem this year.
Go back and check the game scores. Specifically, note how many points were actually given up by the defense.
Now, check the scoring average by the offense.
Compare these numbers to the rest of the league.
This has been a top tier defense in terms of preventing scoring. All but three games were kept at 24 pts or less (and that one included a gift from the offense). In the three games where they got blown up, one was their fault – they couldn’t stop the Saints at all. The other two (Colts, Houston) were largely due to the offense not being able to stay on the field in the second half – and the Houston game hardly counts anyway.
So that’s really just one truly bad game by the Defense all year. I would hang 4 of the other 5 losses on the Offense. The Houston game is a toss.
I was just making the point that this isn't the same team as last year.
It’s not like Brady got plugged right back into the 07, or even 08 team.
And the D, though generally good, has shown the signs of the youth movement. They don’t step up in big games; they fold under pressure – things that wouldn’t have happened had we kept the mass amount of veteran leadership that fled Foxboro this past offseason.
I know you're a'trolling, but that's why I love you.
He’s not really had an MVP season, I agree. But the records don’t really compare if you take the strength of schedule into account. Or the mass exodus referred to above. Everything has been a bit hinky, though. I thought things were coming together, but then Welker bit it and the play calling sucked again. I honestly have no idea what kind of team is going to show up on Sunday.
As Mr. Sloan always says, there is no "I" in team, but there is an "I" in pie. And there's an "I" in meat pie. Anagram of meat is team... I don't know what he's talking about. --Shaun of the Dead
by JohnHannahRules on Jan 6, 2010 3:09 PM EST up reply actions
I know, it's the same sort of excitement you get from Russian Roulette
Click and you move on, or one and out.
My life has been a trivial pursuit. Trivia: where three roads meet.
The more you know, the more you know that you don't know.
by SlotMachinePlayer on Jan 6, 2010 3:21 PM EST up reply actions
Probably a really bad analogy.
My life has been a trivial pursuit. Trivia: where three roads meet.
The more you know, the more you know that you don't know.
by SlotMachinePlayer on Jan 6, 2010 3:21 PM EST up reply actions
Pretty apt, I'd say.
“Winning” isn’t exciting. You’re just left nervous for the next round, having no indicator of what to expect.
Especially if you don't spin the chamber each time.
Each click just makes to think more about the eventual boom.
That’s what I’m worried most about this year. When do we go boom?
My life has been a trivial pursuit. Trivia: where three roads meet.
The more you know, the more you know that you don't know.
by SlotMachinePlayer on Jan 6, 2010 3:32 PM EST up reply actions
lol
I’m not trolling. I wanted to hear a sound argument as to why he should be in contention for the MVP is all.
"Yea, verily, we shall overcome thy pathetic attempts at defense, thou jelly-livered knave! Talk not of thy smack to me, for I shall wedge mine booted foot nine furlongs up thy ass, bitch! Canst thou dig it??"
Not to prolong the discussion
but these arguments always boil down to the question of how you define “MVP.” Is it the best player on the best team? Is it the best player in the league? Is it the player without whom that team would be most disadvantaged?
Lot’s of guys will be on a couple of those lists, and on the last question in particular, I’d say you could make a solid argument for Brady but he’d lose to CJ or maybe even Manning. Or Brees. Or Rivers.
But if you were going to try to make the best argument for having Brady in contention, that would be the one I’d go with. He’s not the best player on the best team and he’s not the best player in the league this year. But I think the Pats would be no where without him and certainly not in the playoffs. I don’t think he wins it on that argument, mind you. But it is a sound case for putting him in contention.
As Mr. Sloan always says, there is no "I" in team, but there is an "I" in pie. And there's an "I" in meat pie. Anagram of meat is team... I don't know what he's talking about. --Shaun of the Dead
by JohnHannahRules on Jan 7, 2010 2:11 PM EST up reply actions
interesting article about brady
http://espn.go.com/blog/afceast/post/_/id/8755/brady-rates-as-nfls-best-qb-in-09
Non Sibi Sed Patriae.
Igitur qui desiderat pacem, praeparet bellum!
I bleed Scarlet and Grey...A Buckeye for Life
MVP
Because people refuse to acknowledge that HE DOES deserve it. Congrats! to you Tom on all that you have accomplised in your career.
I believe his performance (or lack of) today says it all
Brady need to be traded…he is damaged goods both physically and mentally (after losing the Super Bowl and now a home playoff game). He has suddenly turned into a sissy, hating any contact; if we don’t scrap him now, we will be saddled for the remainder of his career with mediocrity. We will never have any high draft picks (and I don’t mean first rounders, I mean high picks in each subsequent round where you claim the bulk of your players. Trade him for serious future picks to a team with desperate, poor management (like, say the Browns or the Seahawks or the Rams). Stockpile 2011, 12, and -13 picks, so the future of the team is more stable. The Pats are teetering on the edge of falling apart similar to the Mets—aging, high-priced vets that are injury prone, and with no second-tier replacements to fill in. There needs to be a wholesale change, and a message sent to the remaining players—-those that under-perform will be terminated, no matter who you are. Losing Seymour wasn’t so bad, except that there were no fill-ins on the DL when the injury bug hit (amazing, the Pats always seem to have injuries to specific positions: DL, LB, DB, OL—-always in bunches). I support the trade, but there shouldn’t be any surpises about the lack of back-up’s for Ty Warren and Jarvis Green. So, I implore, say goodbye to Brady, trade him (now that he’s proven “healthy”), and continue building back to what the Pats were known for early on in the 2000’s—-tough, hard-hitting line play with a deep second string and an offense that could dominate time of possession, and thus the tempo of the game. When you control the ball (ie. time and turnovers, you win). I am posting this everywhere I can.
SB doesn't like trolls, obviously.
Trading Brady when he still has tread on the tyres and is almost impossible to replace. Very clever.
I bet the Giants are really pleased with how they got rid of Kurt Warner and then broke the bank to pay Eli Manning. Especially when Warner turns around and takes his team to the Superbowl in 2008 and to the divisional game (at least) in 2009. Especially when Eli fails to even make the playoffs in 2009. Heh.
And I bet the Colts are devastated that they didn’t get rid of Peyton Manning in 2002 or 2003 or 2004 when he lost playoff games in the first couple of rounds. You know, right before he won the Superbowl? And he was the same age Brady is now when Manning won his first one. So I bet the Colts are kicking themselves for not trading Manning in 2002 or 2003. Mhmm.
Token southern hemisphere guy - 14,688km from Foxboro. That's 9128 miles, for you heathens.
by Comedic.Sans on Jan 10, 2010 10:43 PM EST up reply actions
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