Bigger Super Bowl XLVI Patriots Storyline: Revenge or Legacy?
by Greg Knopping on Jan 25, 2012 5:04 PM EST
in Opinion/Analysis
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PrintOver the next few days, we're going to continue to get into the X's and O's of the New England Patriots Super Bowl XLVI match-up against the New York Giants. This evening, however, we're going to focus on a more philosophical question: what will be the bigger Patriots storyline in the big game - the chance for revenge or the chance to cement the team's legacy?
Of course, a victory in Super Bowl XLVI would kill two birds with one stone. The Patriots would get revenge against the Giants team that ended their chance for perfection in 2007, and they would cement their place in history as one of the greatest dynasties ever with a fourth Super Bowl in ten years (although the question about whether or not a Super Bowl XLVI victory would act as an extension of the dynasty will be addressed later).
Today, however, I want to know which potential storyline seems bigger to you? In other words, if the Patriots were to beat the Giants next Sunday, what would mean more to you?
For me, it has to be the chance to avenge the teams 17-14 loss to the Giants in Super Bowl XLII. There's no doubt that the loss has stuck not only with Tom Brady and Bill Belichick, but the entire New England region since February 3rd, 2008. Ever since the loss, I've said that the only thing that could truly erase those scars would be another Super Bowl victory. To get it against the very team that beat the Patriots in Super Bowl XLII would be a "perfect" ending, so to speak. Or, you know, the Patriots could lose and it could be the worst possible ending to a season imaginable.
The chance to add to Tom Brady and Bill Belichick's legacy as the greatest coach-quarterback combo in NFL history also can't be ignored. As a team, the Patriots have done some pretty special stuff in the last decade. But you could certainly argue, since the team hasn't won a Super Bowl in seven years, that the "run" is over, and that a victory next Sunday wouldn't add to the legacy of those teams.
So which storyline is bigger in your eyes?
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The Super Bowl win this year would be great to stifle the pain from Black Sunday
but nothing can ever fully remove the tarnish that it put on the legacies of this dynasty. They had a chance to be the definitive greatest team, greatest dynasty of all time, even in the era of free agency and salary caps. Unless the Pats go on another undefeated run, nothing can fix that.
That being said, this Super Bowl would certainly add to the legacies of the Pats, especially Belichick and Brady. Belichick gets his 6th ring, fourth as a head coach; Brady gets his 4th, becomes winningest quarterback in playoff history, and continues to cement his legacy as perhaps the greatest quarterback of all time. In my eyes he certainly is.
However, like you said, one can certainly argue that 2007 was the end of the dynasty, or 2008 when Brady went down and the rest of the veterans packed it in. If that’s the case, then perhaps a win here in SB XLVI would begin a new dynasty, one riddled with young players and old journeymen, with the only holdovers being Brady, his faithful blindside protector, his old security blanket in Kevin Faulk, and, of course, the wizard himself, Belichick.
Whichever way you decide to slice it, a win here would mean more for the legacies of Belichick and Brady than anything else. Although beating this particular opponent would just be icing on the cake ;)
It matters not how strait the gate, nor charged with punishments the scroll:
I am the Master of my fate. I am the Captain of my soul.
by BigRussNovak on Jan 25, 2012 5:19 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
The dynasty of the 2000s is over. The dynasty of the 2010s is about to begin.
Paraphrased from Gandalf, LOTR 2.
I touched on a lot of this in my FanPost “This is our Moment”
Lakers and Patriots forever.
its still the same dynasty
its only a diff dynasty when there is a HC & QB change
Tedy Bruschi- "How do we feel about being AFC Champs?"
Team- "Aww Yeah!!!"
by freeland1787 on Jan 25, 2012 6:10 PM EST up reply actions
That's what I'd say.
The more you know, the more you know that you don't know.
Some people can learn from the mistakes of others, while some people need to pee on the electric fence themselves.
Belichick is looking for a new name for his boat: VI Rings sounds pretty good.
by SlotMachinePlayer on Jan 25, 2012 6:57 PM EST up reply actions
I wouldn't even agree with that.
The premier team in the NFL is the Pittsburgh Steelers. They certainly had a pretty terrible few years in the 80s and early 90s, but 6 Lombardis with three coaches, and the sustained success from Cowher to Tomlin are a testament to the strength of a franchise.
In the decade of the 2000s, no team won more, or won more super bowls than New England. In terms of pure dominance, even the loss in 07 shouldn’t diminish the fact of that dominance. Yes, it is less than what might have been. But there has been none better over that time — none.
If by some fortune or miracle, the franchise continues to succeed for the rest of Brady’s career and that success persists beyond his retirement and continues with another coach and a different quarterback, I wouldn’t consider that a dynastic change. The dynasty runs with the franchise.
"Every time I call it a game, you call it a business. Every time I call it a business, you call it a game."
"The longer they play, the more they lose. In the end, we get it all."
by JohnHannahRules on Jan 25, 2012 11:30 PM EST up reply actions
I wouldnt agree
When everyone around you leaves, you have a totally new team. The leaders are still the same, but there is a changing of the guard. A new generation.
It’s like in Rome. The Republic came to an end and the empire began. You could say that technically Rome is the same but the people changed.
I define a dynasty around the people who allowed it to come to pass. To get technical, the only way a dynasty would continue when 90% of an organization moves on is if their biological kids continue the tradiiton. That hasn’t happened. We’ve recruited a whole new team practically. There’s only been 2 constants the entire time – Brady and BB. It’s like having a couple leaders but everyone else changes.
Dynasty implies ruling over. We ruled over the NFL from 2001-2007. But I think we can safely say we didn’t from 2008-2010. Now, we’re back on top. It IS a new dynasty. IF this was a history lecture, it’d read like this:
Emperor Belichick and his general Brady ruled over the NFL. However, on the verge of their greatest triumph and conquest, a band of giants defeated their troops. The next year, the famed elite troops that had followed behind General Brady for several years began to die and retire. Soon, only a few ancient warriors were left to inspire the new recruits. The empire was over. Although there was talk of restoring it to its former glory and boundaries, plenty of other countries maliciously whispered about the demise and imminent collapse of the country. Emperor Belichick was emperor in name only. General Brady was injured in the first battle of the campaign and other generals and warriors fought for him. But they could not defeat the countries surrounding them. Soon new generals in other places began to try replicate the Empire. General Brees and his cunning ruler Cardinal Payton tried very hard to replicate the dynasty. So did another older country, with a very ancient and proud heritage. This land, a frozen tundra, recruited a new army and with the brilliant general Rodgers leading them began to come very close to the Empire.
However,the same band of Giants, now larger and more strong defeated General Rodgers in a shocking battle. General Brees also came up short while fighting another rising kingdom. Meanwhile, the Patriot Empire was rebuilding. Emperor Belichick recruited and trained new warriors, hired mercenaries, and General Brady recovered and began to be even more brilliant in planning. However, the army was not yet ready. It faltered against a brash band of Jets, a loud and obnoxious people who deliberately set out to conquer the Empire’s former lands. Another group of proud warriors, led by a hero named Ray Lewis overwhelmed the Patriot army in the first meeting.
But finally this year, the Patriot empire was strong enough. The pieced-together army was scrappy and never gave up. Even when facing strange foes like the Wizard of Denver, a young man who seemed to channel supernatural powers, they never faltered. When facing the brash Jets, this army confronted them and defeated them convincingly. The Jets fell into disarray and their country tottered on collapse. But the Empire began to reconquer its territory. The army extended the boundaries back to 2007 boundaries, thus reclaimed almost all of the Empire’s old territory. However, the mythical city of Lombardi, a city which the Empire had once possessed had been wrenched away in the year of 2007.
Although the band of giants, General Rodgers, General Brees, and other generals each tried to overtake it, no one general could keep it. This year, waiting in the passes, was the Empire’s first nemesis. The band of giants. It remains to be seen whether the giants will defeat the Empire and keep them from establishing the new era or if the Empire shall regain its former glory and once more demand tribute from every nation in the world.
Lakers and Patriots forever.
by D.S.T. on Jan 26, 2012 10:27 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
I'm a vengeful bastard
so the opportunity for revenge immediately jumps off the page. I like being the Patriots fan with a chip on my shoulder.
That being said, a few years down the road the legacy itself becomes increasingly more important when you really sit back and absorb the achievements Tom Brady, Bill Belichick and the Patriots were able to accomplish.
It’s A, which fades into B under the test of time.
Can I Scream?
I do not know which headline is bigger
But the legacy of our team is much more transcendent. If the pats were playing the niners, the legacy would still be just as huge and important. However if the Giants were having a rematch against the ravens that kicked their butts a decade ago, we would barely care. It would be one of the bigger story lines of the series but not many would care. This rematch is a big deal because the pats are the pats, because the patriots have a legacy.
Legacy
I don’t believe revenge can be achieved due to how special that moment was in 07, a perfect season is one for the ages that may not be done by this team again, I mean have the chance.
by Brady's Revenge on Jan 25, 2012 6:04 PM EST reply actions
just for that comment it will happen again
we will never know when tho
Tedy Bruschi- "How do we feel about being AFC Champs?"
Team- "Aww Yeah!!!"
by freeland1787 on Jan 25, 2012 6:11 PM EST up reply actions
Maybe it can happen again in 2012. With a rather weak schedule like what we play
next season, it can be done. But it’s just so unlikely though.
Depth is great. Right up until you need it!!
They're both good story lines
I wish it was more “legacy” and less revenge. But the only 4 teams that have beaten Brady in the playoffs are
The Jets (handled in the regular season)
The Broncos (handled in round one)
The Ravens (handled in the AFC championship)
and
The Giants (coming soon to a Sunday near you)
you forgot indy? what do they do about them
or does manning potentially getting the door do it? patriots haven’t gotten a chance to settle the score vs manning yet
Tedy Bruschi- "How do we feel about being AFC Champs?"
Team- "Aww Yeah!!!"
by freeland1787 on Jan 25, 2012 6:11 PM EST up reply actions
more like manning has yet to settle the score against brady
and even if he did, doing in his little brother on his field has got to count for something….ughhhh we neeeed to win man, i cant take this again.
We win the Super Bowl in Indianapolis is how he settles the score!
by RSmitty on Jan 25, 2012 6:20 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
That's the answer.
"These players, a lot of other people didn't believe in them, but they believe in themselves. And that is all that matters."- Bill Belichick
Revenge is a dish that is not on the menu.
Seriously, even if we (by some miracle) shellack the Giants by 45 points, it won’t change the fact that the Pats lost their shot at perfection to the Giants.
What a win can do is establish that this team’s dynasty isn’t “fading away.” The Pats have been consistently relevant over the past ten years, and people are starting to forget that given that there are no Rings to punctuate the fact with.
people can call it the revenge bowl
i call it the redemption bowl
Tedy Bruschi- "How do we feel about being AFC Champs?"
Team- "Aww Yeah!!!"
by freeland1787 on Jan 25, 2012 9:45 PM EST up reply actions
The Pats-Colts rivalry intensifies...
In Indianapolis to face Eli Manning and the NYG! I originally wanted Saints-Pats for an offensive power-game, but after Drew Brees got knocked off I just went for the Giants to seek revenge. Who knew the Pats would face Baltimore, and avenged that series too. This is redemption season! Let’s go pats!
I think it's a perfect storm.
Sure, most of the players did not play in that ‘07 SB but they are here to avenge those that did. This isn’t simply getting back at the Giants, but reestablishing what made Tom Brady great, Bill Belichick great, and the New England Patriots great. However these factors alone aren’t what makes this opportunity special.
When BJGE ran in for that TD against the Ravens, he pointed at a patch on his jersey that read “MHK”. In 2007 Tom Brady and his team were playing for a superficial record. In this 2011 season, it’s not really about Tom Brady, Belichick, or simply the rest of the players; it’s about coming together as a team, an organization and a family and fighting for a single purpose in which the passing of Myra Kraft represents.
The MHK patch wasn’t something they put on their jersey’s and dedicated their season to just because they felt bad for Mr. Kraft, but it’s purpose was to remind every player, every day that it’s more than just about records and legacy; that this game is about playing it because you love it.
When someone loves something so much, they are relentless in their pursuit to make it theirs, and that’s what the Lombardi trophy symbolizes for this sport. The New England Patriots will not obtain the pinnacle of success if they are without their passion. Vengeance and legacy are alright, but MHK represents a pure love for this sport that I think a lot of players today have forgotten. If this team remembers that, then everything else will take care of itself.
Shawn Johnson... she's a nice lady
by Noah Lot on Jan 25, 2012 8:01 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
all the guys left from 2007 are some of the best players at their positions in the NFL
Brady
Welker
Gostkowski
Light
Mankins
Wilfork
only Faulk isn’t starting
Tedy Bruschi- "How do we feel about being AFC Champs?"
Team- "Aww Yeah!!!"
by freeland1787 on Jan 25, 2012 9:49 PM EST up reply actions
Noah Lot- You said it. And you said it well. This is about MHK. And I feel that way. Revenge sounds nice on paper. Legacy sounds good on paper. But the truth of the matter is that Myra would have wanted them to play their best game. And play it in the spirit of what is important. Revenge is an empty plate. And I want none of it. We can discuss legacies when everyone retires. But Myra, Myra’s influence is THE most important thing now. Nothing else in my mind.
I just want them to win
so I don’t have to read/hear “They haven’t won anything since spygate…psshhh Belicheat” Only a superbowl is the perfect solution.
So, you think if they win that'll stop?
Please, dude.
"Every time I call it a game, you call it a business. Every time I call it a business, you call it a game."
"The longer they play, the more they lose. In the end, we get it all."
by JohnHannahRules on Jan 25, 2012 11:34 PM EST up reply actions
well, yeah
they will have to change it to something else. You can’t say they haven’t won anything since spygate if they have. Maybe it would become “You guys cheated your way into another superbowl….pssshhh Belicheat.” Hey at least its a different refrain.
by Oughat on Jan 26, 2012 1:06 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Quite possibly the biggest game of Tom Brady's career.
Maybe other than the sb in ‘04 that cemented a dynasty, this game has a chance to both add to his legacy of perhaps the greatest qb of all time but also avenge the biggest lost of his career. I don’t really think losing would do as much damage as a win would do good…i’m beginning to get the sense that the patriots are becoming pretty significant underdogs considering that every analyst is picking the giants, to the point of disrespect. jerome bettis, herman edwards, and other veterans and respected analysts all picked the giants, eli over tom, coughlin over belichick, and giant wr’s over patriot te’s. but really, i could care less. i like the patriots in the underdog role. the only thing that really matters is that brady and company are coming in with a burning passion to hoist the lombardi trophy. i just hope they succeed. so many great things can come out of this opportunity that will probably never be seen again for the patriots. if the pats win this one, then brady and belichick won’t ever have to win another sb to be considered the greatest at what they’ve done (although a few more would still be nice). i was gonna quote bart scott, but since that didn’t turn out too well for the jets, i’ll just say i’m really excited for this game. either way, this game is much more than your ordinary superbowl.
It's funny
The Patriots are actually favored in Vegas (granted this may come from betting habits, but they are), yet every pundit I have heard likes the Giants.
But you know what- the pundits have been wrong before:
-The whole CBS team took Pittsburgh to beat Denver.
- If memory serves, a number of pundits took the Ravens to beat the Pats.
- Two weeks ago everybody had the Packers and Saints in the NFC title game.
- I am pretty sure a bunch of people picked the Pats on Black Sunday
As much as the lack of “respect” from the commentators is there (and I had my moment Sunday night when it bothered me)- doesn’t this just play into BB’s hand- heck… he is probably enjoying ESPN helping with his job- not only does he have his bulletin board material, he also has a ready made video loop to go between servings of humble pie.
Bellichick and Brady have nothing left to prove- yes, a win would give them more Super Bowls than any other tandem, but their greatness is already known. In some ways, this Super Bowl brings the team full circle- Few are left from 2007’s loss, and even fewer from the last win. The media is back to not believing in them. Works for me!
"Valdez can pitch, Lee can hit... and pigs can fly."
-The whole CBS team took Pittsburgh to beat Denver.
I think the entire planet did, which is why I was sure we weren’t going to win.
Espn was pretty divided on the Ravens and Pats. The Pats are not disrespected, ever. That’s a product of imagination. Every team and their fans try to play that card. A lot of times all it takes for a fan to do it is hear one negative word about one player or aspect of their team. There is no way on Earth you can really believe the media doesn’t believe in a team with Tom Brady playing qb and Bill Belichick coaching.
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
it's easy -
Eli is “hot” right now. Keep an eye out, they’ll be picking the Giants. I’ve already shut the noise off though, it makes the period leading up to the game less enjoyable for me.
Keep the faith!
"Or, you know, the Patriots could lose and it could be the worst possible ending to a season imaginable."
It’s a close question, but I still don’t think it would be worse than ’07. In my mind, this team has over-achieved. I figured we were still at least a year away from being serious contenders. Even if we lose, this has already been a better season than I expected it to be.
"Every time I call it a game, you call it a business. Every time I call it a business, you call it a game."
"The longer they play, the more they lose. In the end, we get it all."
by JohnHannahRules on Jan 25, 2012 11:32 PM EST reply actions
Making a Superbowl and losing means you’re the 2nd best team in the league
There are 30 worse possible endings
by quadruple option on Jan 26, 2012 2:25 AM EST up reply actions
I agree that this season has already surpassed expectations
and 2007 was a whole different animal.
Keep the faith!
Yeah, I kind of figured we were playing with house money after we beat the Broncos in the Divisional round.
One and done was dead. Anything more was gravy.
The way this is playing out, though is interesting.
Revenge? No, but maybe some guys can exorcise some demons from their past if that helps them have closure.
I see this as the Myra Bowl. Like many people do, they’re trying to make her death mean something positive. The fact that they are coming together as a band of brothers, means it already has done something positive.
The more you know, the more you know that you don't know.
Some people can learn from the mistakes of others, while some people need to pee on the electric fence themselves.
Belichick is looking for a new name for his boat: VI Rings sounds pretty good.
by SlotMachinePlayer on Jan 26, 2012 11:28 AM EST up reply actions
Painful maybe, but definitely not the worst ending...
If everyone walks off that field on Super Bowl Sunday, win or lose, the ending could be worse…
Also, answer me this- and any answer here is ok. Close your eyes and take a journey with me… The Patriots have made this journey- one game at a time. They managed to get first round bye, to romp all over Denver, and to win in an improbable way against the Ravens. But…. Brady is just “off” on that Sunday- he spends most of the day getting hurried and sacked, and makes some poor decisions that keep the Pats from winning. Or they play a close game all day, and Ghost shanks a potentially game tying or winning field goal at the end of regulation. However it may go, the Giants wind up winning. Yes, it sucks… and it hurts like Hell- a gut punch to end the season. But is that truly the worst ending to the season? To have it last all the way until February? I don’t think so. I think the worst ending of the season is spending the last half of it debating whether you should completely pack it in in favor of getting a better draft pick.
Also, every season is a journey, and this year’s, while not the magic carpet ride of 2007 (granted spent running from the demons of Spygate), has been wonderful. It has been Gronk setting tight end records, touchdown passes, and last minute wins. Yeah, it had that rough patch in the middle, with three games of being out of sync, but the good has far outweighed the bad. No matter how things go in Indy- this has been a great ride. And the worst thing of all would be for us to lose sight of that- because the minute that it all comes down to one game as an all or nothing referendum on a team’s legacy- if they win, they will have stamped their mark on history. But if they lose, it is not a disgrace, nor does it erase a whole season of achievements.
"Valdez can pitch, Lee can hit... and pigs can fly."
I’m not sure I agree. You make some strong and valid points. But the whole gist of this for me is to win it all. For me that is. And losing to the Giants will continue to spur talk that the dynasty is over. New England had their chances. Blah, blah, blah. I believe in the Patriots. I knew they would be here this season. I knew they would be playing in the Super Bowl. They had nowhere else to go but Indy this season. Now all they have left to them is to win. And I believe strongly that this is their year to do so. Bob Kraft, and his family deserve to have this chance. And they will make the most of this. For Myra!!!
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